here's another idea for Kyle-keep paying him what we're paying him, but every time Lyle shows up, not only does he not get paid, but he has to pay the Twins back for the previous game. I get the feeling we'd see Kyle a lot more often that way.

I love the idea of only paying Lohse $6.75 an hour. If we go that route we have to make sure he doesn’t pitch in Seattle as Washington’s minimum wage law is $7.35 an hour.

Whatever Johan wants sounds good too.

The current issue of The Sporting News reports Kyle Lohse is candidate for a "comeback" season.

Speaking of pitching, my heart is with the Twins, but I will be watching the Nats this summer, since I live in DC. Not only am I going to have to watch Christian Guzman swat at the ball in his lame manner, now they've signed another load, Esteban Loaiza!

Jim Bowden is making the Nats a tough team for me to like.

I'm surprised the $1.8 mil is considered "far apart." I'm ... I don't know, surprised? shocked? in a state of complete disbelief? that a) Lohse is asking for $2.4 mil and b) the Twins OFFERED him $2.125 mil. I mean, send the tapes of Lohse's games to the board. He'd be lucky to get paid more than he's making now. I don't get it. How can you have that kind of season and have the nerve to ask for SIX TIMES your current salary? The system is whacked.

I'm not going to do jack today at work. And I'm asking for a raise.

Props to Johan given by Dan Shanoff at ESPN's page 2.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/quickie

Always good to see Johan getting the respect he deserves.

"I'm not going to do jack today at work. And I'm asking for a raise."

Hee hee hee.... I like this plan - if it works for Lyle, I might have to nominate him for some lame-o cabinet position.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but can't we pay Lyle less than minimum wage if he's offered tips? The fans could tip him each game he pitches as much as he deserves.

Just Beth

On Santana:
The Daily Quickie on ESPN.com's Page 2 says that your best pitcher, maybe the best pitcher in baseball is asking the Twins for 6.8 million.... and the Twins are offering 5 million....

cue "slap to the face" sound effect...
-SLAP-
does this sound weird to anyone???

I mean, for less than $7 mil a year, the Royals would LOVE to bring a potential "every-year-CY-YOUNG-candidate" to Kansas City. well, probably.

I'm secretly dreaming the Twins drop the ball here and somehow Kansas City swoops in and picks up Cytana... and we win the division and sweep everybody in the playoffs and win a world series 20 years after our last (oh, sweet, sweet '85, we hardly knew ye...)

but something tells me he that's not going to happen.... I'm talking about the Royals, remember. shoot.

seriously, Minny, pay up! If Clemens is asking for $22 million (cough, crackhead, cough) surely you guys can find $7 mil/year for someone who's 10+ years younger than Clemens... and who doesn't throw bats at people, etc.

"I mean, for less than $7 mil a year, the Royals would LOVE to bring a potential "every-year-CY-YOUNG-candidate" to Kansas City. well, probably."

Every team would love to have that for 7 million. I mean Cleveland just gave Millwood 7 million.And I am going to take a shot in the dark here and say if Santana were to go open market(I know he can't for 2 years) That KC and 7 million would not be his first choice. I'm sure both NYs, both LAs, both CHIs, & the evil red sox empire would offer more money and more winning then KC could. I mean Santana would be 1/4 of their payroll.

And yes I know Batgirl, hands off your president.Maybe Batgirl needs to have her own 10 commandments.

Thou shalt not covet thy Twins president.

"I mean, for less than $7 mil a year, the Royals would LOVE to bring a potential "every-year-CY-YOUNG-candidate" to Kansas City."

Ahahaa. One problem. There are two sides to any negotiation, and methinks it would take more than 7 mil a year to influence someone into joining the Royals. Heck, I'm not even a lefty and I'd demand 4.5.

Kyle Lohse has some cojones doesn't he? Man, that guy ceases to amaze me with his attitude.

I think Johan should go into the Witness Protection Program until the Twins pull their heads from their asses and cough up the dough for him.

Every team out there that wants him needs to BACK OFF!! What a bunch of vultures.

You're all too hard on Kyle. After all, he was the fifth best starter on our team.

Kyle was just having a bit of a slump. It happens to all pitchers in the first couple years. It even happened to that pitcher we drafted instead of Mauer. (He ended up being pretty good, that pitcher, and I hear no talk of moving him to third base.)

Mark my words: This is the year of the Lohse. Not only will he rebound, not only will he be the best pitcher on the Twins, not only will he be the most coveted "boy-friend-of-the-day," but he'll be featured on a "Kyle for Cy Young" button in October.

Uppity...what are you on, and where can I get some :D

No year will ever be "The Year of Lohse." Just like there will never be "The Year of Rivas." Because they're both garbage. Crappy ass-garbage.

Hopefully, this not-immediately-signing-Santana silliness is just to keep negotiations on a long-term deal open.

Clearly, Lohse's demand isn't out of line, considering it's almost exactly what the Twins are offering.

As for Santana, he's the Twins property for a couple more years. If they continue to fart around, he'll leave at his first opportunity.

I'd be willing to bet $1,000 that we won't go to arbitration with 3/5 of the rotation. Lohse and the Twins will sign before they get to arbitration, for sure. Hopefully, the Twins will sign Johan to a long term deal before the hearing, too. Very few cases go to arbitration, a significant exception being Santana last year. If the Twins actually go to arbitration with Santana again, I don't think there's any way he'll stay here when he becomes a free agent.

" No year will ever be "The Year of Lohse." Just like there will never be "The Year of Rivas." Because they're both garbage. Crappy ass-garbage. "

Why, Chris, why? :) Here we are talking about how grrrrrreat Johan is and how sometimes Kyle becomes Lyle and you have to go and drag poor innocent Luis into this. OK, OK, so he's not THE greatest player ever, but there he was, just minding his own business. I mean, he probably wouldn't understand the English and all, but still...

Poor Luis, I still love you.

On the Kyle/Lyle note - I like him and remember when he used to be halfway good. I met him in SD during the 2003 interleague with the Padres and I gotta say, back then he seemed like a pretty class guy. He'll come back, it is just a slump. I just hope the attitude is similarly reversible.

Lohse in his career is 40-39 with a 4.86 ERA. I'm not sure that deserves a $2m+ payday; but once you willingly agree to give up $1.6 million for Luis Rivas to return as your starting 2B for the fifth season, I think it's hard to blame any of the other guys for holding their hands out, too. Hell, I'm starting to wonder if the Twins don't owe ME a little something in back wages for all the free advice I've given them over the years! I'm feeling exploited, I tell you!

I just hope it escapes Johan's attention that the Twins offered Lohse half a mil more than they offered him in his first year of arbitration. I know that's just because Kyle has more starts and IP than Johan did, but still.

Anyway, I am encouraged to see that Johan is asking for $6.8m, rather than $8-9, for next year. It gives an idea of where he might set a baseline for the first year of a multi-year deal. If they could compromise at around $6m for the first year, escalating by about $2m in each of the following three years... a $36m/4yr. deal might secure him in Minnesota. And I'm optimistic that the Twins can get that kind of deal done.

Message to Kyle: I pay $7.50/hour. Pitching skills not required.

I like the idea of tipping Lohse. Maybe he'd work for tips alone. Sort of pass around the hat the end of the game and see if anything is in it.

Pity the team that took Eric in the Rule 5 draft didn't take Kyle as well.

Remember Kyle's only good game last year, the complete-game shut-out that took place after Bradke and Johan had already done the same? Maybe Kyle swapped highlight tapes to T-Ry and crew when they weren't looking during their what-we-think-Kyle-is-really-worth meeting that only included his one good game of the year looped over and over...

If you are going to be like Kyle at work it's not enough to "just do jack", you have to ruin everyone else's work too.

And along those lines, you don't ask for a raise...you demand one!

YankeeFan

Torii Hunter's gettin' baserunning props from ESPN.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=rogers_phil&id=1968962

Probably just stating the obvious, but.... The good news is, the Twins don't really need to worry about alienating Santana. The bad news is, that's because they already have virtually no chance of keeping him once he reaches free agency. The trick is to get as many years as they can now during their single window of opportunity to sign a multi-year contract. At the end of that period, assuming he maintains his level of performance and that there is not some wild and unforeseen shakeout in the economics of major league baseball, he will be beyond the means of not only the Twins but all but the elite few top teams in the business. As I see it, there is no way the Twins will be able to tie up one fifth to one quarter of their payroll in one pitcher, which is what his market value is likely to be at that point. It's not just a case of a tightwad owner -- it's not like the Twins are alone in this. It is the depressing reality of MLB economics.

On the brighter side, nice article on Torii!

Smitty

Why do people have to be so mean to Lohse. Geez. He's not that bad, and he really wasn't any worse last year than in 2003, when people liked him because he wasn't Mays or Reed, but he had a stretch that year of 11.4 ERA over five successive starts. Last year Lohse made less than $400k, went 9-13, and pitched 190 innings. Anybody know what the Twins' record was in games where Lohse got no decision? Ten wins, two losses, that's what, and some of them were mighty fine performances by Lohse that went into deep extra innings. So the Twins went 19-15 in Lohse's 2004 starts, hardly the ledger of a contemptible goat.

In this age of 12-man staffs, won-loss record by a starter is not the meaningful stat it used to be. Look at the Yankees last year. The job of a starting pitcher nowadays is to take the ball when it's his turn, eat up innings, and keep his team in the game. Lohse never misses a start, 2003-04. Sure young Kyle had some real stinkeroos last year, but so did Santana. You can look it up, or don't we count the 17-7 shellacking here at the hands of the Bitch Sox?

There are dozens of pitchers maybe hundreds or even thousands who made $3 million or $7 million or $12 million last year who really weren't as good as Lohse was even last year when yes it's true sometimes he really really sucked a little. So as a community I don't think we should begrudge the young fella a measly $2.4 million. Although Latrell Sprewell finds it hard to believe, brave Kyle is willing to try to feed his family on that paltry sum. Look at what Joe Mays is making, and I don't think he'll ever be as good a pitcher as Lohse is right this minute over a two- or three-year period. (Secret predictor key: strikeouts per inning, young righthanded starters.)

I agree with the comments above suggesting the possibility that Lohse might have a huge season one of these days. He's pretty close to being a star - only minor adjustments necessary.

So if you get a rotation of CyY Santana, Ace Radke, and any three guys as good as Kyle Lohse (unspectacular as that is)worth a 19-15 record apiece in all their starts assuming no improvement whatever, you get a team that will win 100 games and walk away with the division.

So c'mon Batlings. Let's all make 2005 the Summer of Lohse Lohve, and maybe the sulky little sucker of lemons and sour grapes will bask in the glow of pulsating positivity, and maybe go 14-9.