The best lie was the truth. He said he never injected himself. It's very hard to give yourself a shot in the behind. He had someone else do it.

I have nothing to add except maniacal laughter.

I sure hope the noose tightens around the area between Bonds' head and body (the region that is supposed to be the neck!)

I heard an interview of Bonds once where he made the assertion that people do not like him and root against him because he is black. What a crock of shit. Barry, wake up, it is because of your attitude and how you treat people, and I would root against a person of any color who acted like you!

Win Twins in 2005!

Perhaps the quote of the year;

"...[A]nd pee could probably mean anything."

Comedic gold, I tell 'ya.

I have never been a Barry-hater, and in fact I was glad to see him doing so well -- I could believe his assertions that he got less respect/press about the HR record because he's black and Big Mac is white. (Of course, it helped that Big Mac is a great guy and Bonds is a total ass, but whatever.) Now, however, I think that he should be banned from baseball and from the Hall. Baseball needs to get its shit together and put a stop to these dangerous and game-altering (not to mention body-altering) drugs once and for all. Bonds will rot in the same baseball hell that Pete Rose is going to.

Whatever happened to my dear, sweet baseball players that just have natural talent? If anything ever came up about any Twins players, I would be so heartbroken.

Life long Barry fan. Share same birthday, even got the little cross earing when I played ball that he used to wear. Had his pirates 24 number as my playing number. Loved him.

However, it really sucks that he had to use Steroids (of course, he didn't know...I thought the smoke in my college apartment was cigarette smoke). He was damn good before he became *Beefcake*. It's pretty sad.

Dearest Stacy,

If you can't see that Punto is at least on the clear if not the cream, you're just turning a blind eye to the obvious. Take your head out of the sand and look around. How do you think that Punto went from sideshow curiousity to the 5-foot-nothing, 122 lb. monstrosity he's become.

Metabolically yours,

Shoeless Joe

From cnnsi.com-
"On Tuesday's Howard Stern Show, Kris' wife Anna made it clear that she would get more than even with her husband if he slept with a baseball groupie. 'I told him -- because that's the biggest thing in athletics, they cheat all the time -- I told him, cheat on me all you want,' she said. 'If you get caught, I'm going to screw everybody on your entire team, coaches, trainers, players. I would do everybody on his whole team.'"

Lew Ford sighs, "If we only made that trade."

If only indeed.

-N.M.

Compare and contrast:

http://tinyurl.com/4mqvr

and

http://tinyurl.com/6f5nt

Too close to call, in my opinion. Banning Barry from the hall would be a great lesson, but I am not sure it is entirely justified. This is a problem without a clear-cut solution for past infractions, but one which clearly needs a bright-line solution for the future.

Of course, we should start by being open to all the options:

1) Let ballplayers do whatever they want.

The argument here seems straightforward at first, and even appears to be reasonable. The vocation of their choice offers them an option. You can trade in a portion of your life, risk future health problems, including cancer, etc. and in return there is a good chance your overall plate performance will improve. If everyone was offered the same opportunity, then it would seem that this option would work out. Except for one small detail: tomorrow's MLB players are today's children. We must ensure that parents and children know that the trade of one's health for money is NOT an option. I don't think I would care if current ballplayers take life-threatening performance enhancers...but if there was a possibility that my child would want to "be like Mike" and trade life for a shot at a pro sport....well, you get the idea.

2) Regulate with penalty levels

Most pro sports have a banned substance list with penalties for first offense, second offense, etc. Unfortunately, MLB's is way to lax. MLB could make it like track and field - one offense and you are banned for 2 years. Somewhere in between is a better option, but this is like Solomon splitting the baby. You allow players to reap the benefits (and dollars) until they are caught the first or second time. I can't understand how this is a satisfactory result. I am certain the NCAA has a more stringent penalty (though I admit I don't know what it is). What is the justification for allowing more lenient penalties for cheating by (very well) PAID players than penalties for scholarship student-athletes?

3) You're Banned

This seems over the top at first blush. We really only have two examples of a ban from the game because of cheating. We have the Black Sox throwing the World Series, and we have Pete Rose. The rest of the world of "cheating" includes doctoring a baseball, corking a bat, etc. So where does using steroids fit in? Does the guy using steroids get as harsh a penalty as a player who intentionally strikes out (or a manager who doesn't bring in his strongest reliever) because he put $75K on the other team to win? At the very least, the player who is taking performance enhancers is attempting to win for his team -- to me a major distinction from the "banned" cheaters. So a ban from baseball now appears to be too harsh.

So what do we do (if I left out any alternatives, please feel free to add)? Assuming I have to pick something right now (admittedly last week I felt differently...damn media) I would go with option 3. Err on the side of penalties that are too harsh. The pros include 1) fan satisfaction and confidence in product; 2) the children (WON'T SOMEBODY PLEASE THINK ABOUT THE CHILDREN); 3) player's lives (although some may argue it is not our job to protect them...it is). One could argue that the economics of the game would settle because offensive statistics would drop back into human-related levels. So add owners to the list (at the expense of players who would have to settle for $5 million instead of $7 million -- poor poor players). Also, people are forgetting that there may be players that can't break into the majors because they aren't good enough without performance enhancers. What about their families?

On another note, the talks about Giambi's contract really surprise me. First of all, maybe this incident will prompt owners to more explicitly define the "physical fitness" clause in players' contracts to include banned substance use. Owners can't reasonably be expected to commit large sums of money to players who may be purposely harming their own physical condition (at least that is the argument).

That being said, it amazes me that the world is talking about dropping Giambi's contract, but not a word is being said about Sheffield. Now, y'all know I own a chef's hat for one purpose and one purpose only (actually two purposes, I play poker in casinos with it -- it throws people off, but that's another story) and even I think that if you drop Giambi you have to drop Sheffield.

Here's how I think it through: If you activate the morals clause to terminate Giambi (so far the prevelant theory) then Sheff has to go as well. They essentially did the same thing (morally) and allowing "I didn't know" to be a reasonable excuse is a bad idea. Giambi told the truth and we need more truth in this world (of course, let us not forget that he told the truth in court and still lied later about it). Anyway, sorry Yankee fans, Giambi goes, Sheff goes with him.

EXCEPT, if they activate the physical fitness clause, then they can probably keep Sheffield (who keeps himself in great shape, right?) and get rid of Giambi. If that worked, it is the way I would go, because you could then get rid of Sheff if he deteriorated. My problem with that is that it gives owners a unilateral advantage over players (or at least players who juice).

OK, I'm done, you can all wake up now and get back on with your day.

YankeeFan

1) Ban the steroids, test regularly

Oh and of a more pressing concern:

I didn't know about BatMom and the catnip -- does this mean the trusty, reliable lefty reliever will be unavailable for the coming season? Oh wait, it would only be her first offense...nevermind.

YankeeFan

*note to self

read espn.com before typing.

YankeeFan

*note to self

Be more discrete around daughter.

I bet Barry Bonds' blood is radioactive now, like Spidey's.

LOL at Batmom

If you need proof that baseball is the best sport-here it is.

Every year, baseball takes a machine gun to it's foot, leg, arms, basically everybody part it can hit (not its butt-someone else needs to shoot/inject you there). Yet, somehow, baseball continues and even thrives. Contraction, labor disputes, steriods, Bud Selig, the Expos/Nats bungling, the Yankees steriod induced payroll, etc... yet people not only come back, more people come. Think about that. I mean the baseball offseason always invariably has some huge scandal that makes me want to light myself on fire-and yet, it's almost always solved (or at least is sent away) by the magical words "pitchers and catchers report", "opening day", "Play Ball" and "TWINS WIN".
So basically, I'm basically, what I'm saying is, Can it be April 4th now?

Also, my opinon on Bonds is that he was/is a great player. I never really liked him as a person, but then again, I also don't assume that the way a person acts w/ the press is really indicitive of who they are. I mean, based on watching all those yelling shows on ESPN / Fox Sports, a lot of the sports reporters look pretty slimy/annoying and I'd probably be just as big an ass to them as Bonds is, but that's just me.
Remember, baseball is the sport where steriods probably helps you the least-yeah he got bigger, but w/o his eye for the plate, ridiculous bat speed (which comes from his wrists-something roids doesn't help) and patience, he's just some big dude. I mean, Big Papi has always been huge-did that make him good? So he used roids, and yeah, it helped him, but it's really tough to tell how much using roids helped him. Also, it's not like he was cheating-baseball didn't consider it cheating at the time. Kinda like Andro and McGwire.

-TBird

Hate to admit it, but I agree completely with YankeeFan: ban Barry from the hall. It's very simple. You took illegal drugs to improve your performance. Therefore, the validity of that performance is tainted and not a real record.

Begone Barry!

As this scandal continues to grow, MLB is going to have to take some stern measures to stop it. This could become a challenge as great as the 1919 "Black Sox" scandal. If people cannot trust the authenticity of the game they're watching then baseball's in trouble.

Oh, just to be clear-I'm not saying Big Papi used roids, I was saying he was big when he was mediocre w/ the Twins and he's big when he's good w/ the Sox.
-Tbird

BadAndy,

1) It is not a crime to agree with me, or anyone else :)

2) Let's not forget the message that it sends to future generations...don't juice, or you'll be wiped from the books... as if health concerns weren't enough of a deterrent.

YankeeFan

>>"I don't understand this piece of paper," Bonds replied.<<

-----

Theirs was a love like no other. He was a promising rookie with the Pittsburgh Pirates. She was a random sheet of 20 pound bond that seemed to stand out in her understated way in conformity to her sisters in the ream. She often thought "I'm so like everyone else in this ream, I'm truly unique in my sameness." It must have been this fiery spirit that Barry Bonds noticed when he first saw sheet#238, because from that moment on they were rarely apart.

It was an innocent relationship at first. They would take turns choosing what they would do on their dates. One week he'd pick the casual dinner followed by a carriage ride around the park, the next she'd want to visit the forest, where she understood her ancestors were from. Sometimes before dates she would splurge on a makeover at Kinkos.

Then some time around March of 1998 over supper she asked Barry about a trip home to visit her ream sisters, after all, she hadn't seen them since Barry whisked her away. Barry without thinking replied "They're probably all in a landfill or shredded into plastic bags by now." and continued eating his pancakes. Immediately she burst into inconsolable tears, and their relationship was never the same.

They grew apart, he focused on his baseball. She stayed at home and took care of the notepad they adopted 5 years earlier. Barry noticed her seeming more and more distant, and was asked more often about when he'd be going back out on the road and less about when he'd be coming home. Finally, the end came one day when he returned from a particularly grueling road trip. He dropped his bags in the foyer and when he got to the den he saw her near the printer with pencil marks on her. She was having an affair!

"That's it!", Barry said, "We're through!"

The custody battle for the notepad was heated and ugly. She went into sordid details about all the kinky things Barry wanted to do with her in the den, things like "paper airplane" and "origami crane". He was just as vicious, saying that she was too yellowed and brittle to adequately care for notepad. She'd changed from being the innocent but lively sheet he'd fallen in love with into a bitter old scrap of parchment who's motives and temperament had changed completely. "I don't understand this piece of paper," Bonds replied when asked in court about why he wanted custody. He added "The sheet#238 I knew when we first met would have been capable of caring for the notepad, but not what she's turned into. I fear for the safety of both of them, frankly."

The judge awarded custody of the notepad to Barry Bonds, and he continues to bring it with him to every game and on every road trip. It turns 7 next year. Sheet#238s fate hasn't been so good, after a brief stint at the bottom of Yorvit Torrealba's birdcage she found herself in a landfill herself.

Not to defend Bonds or anything, but recent events have made me somewhat skeptical of the press. So, I have the following questions:

1) How did the Chronicle get these transcripts anyway? Grand jury proceedings are supposed to be secret. I know we'll never get to find out, but it would be interesting to know if the leak was a "whistle-blower" just trying to get the info to the public or someone with a vested personal/political/monetary interest in bringing this up. I assume since there has been no post-leak denials from the Bonds/Giambi camps that the transcripts are accurate and that this is not a CBS News National Guard "memo" fiasco.

2) If Bonds was taking steroids and then stopped, how come he doesn't look any physically different? Giambi may be an extreme case, but I wouldn't there be at least some loss of muscle mass?

3) Can anyone believe anything Victor Conte says? First he admits he gave steroids to people, then denies, then conveniently changes his mind once ESPN magazine decides to give him a big article. The guy rivals Conseco and Rose for the No Such Thing As Bad Publicity Award.

Anyway, like I said, I'm not trying to defend Bonds here -- these are just questions that keep popping up as I read these articles that no one is answering (the ESPN article doesn't even mention Conte's previous admissions/detractions and never questions his credibility at all).

I can't believe Bonds. Everybody in the world is getting steroids from his trainer except him. Oh yeah...riiiight.

This whole thing officially makes it so that no sport is pure anymore.

The NFL has turned into rampant showing-off and illegal drug use.

The NHL has become a bunch of greedy jerks who want to paid with money that doesn't exist.

The NBA is now a place where the fans aren't safe, and players/annoucers condone it. Not to mention recent comments that fans hate the players because they're (to paraphrase Charles Barkley) "Successful black athletes with a lot of money."

And now the MLB has a bunch of cheaters. And everybody believes them. Giambi, Sheffield, Bonds...all should be fired. Not allowed to play anymore. If Pete Rose is gone from MLB because he bet against his own team (and on baseball in general) then these guys should be gone for cheating. Sosa corks his bat and he's back next year.

The biggest slap in the face to fans is when Sheffield admits to using it a few years ago ('unknowingly'...yeah right), yet they tell him "Don't worry, we don't see a need to test you anymore."

At the very least, any players connected to this Anderson guy (or who admits to steroid use...'unknowingly' or not) should be forced to take tests before, during and after every game for the rest of their career.

I'm sick of this whole thing. It's disgusting what sports has become.

He cannot pronounce "EPO"?

It starts out like "ERA", okay? Then, it has the same exact sound as "pee", which could mean ANYthing, then ends with "Ohhhhh!", like, "Ohhhh right".

Does Barry Bonds know anything?

Just the other day, RD and a friend were watching some 1987 Twins highlights from when they clinched the AL West and we were struck by the physiques of the ballplyers. Brunansky, Gaetti, even Hrbek -- big guys at the time -- looked downright svelte compared with their contemporary counterparts. (We were also struck by the bad hair of the sports anchors and the pink sportsjacket that anchor-turned-Congressman-turned-Daddy of Demonspawn Rod Grams wore in the Channel 9 studios that night, but that's another story.)

I hope the BALCO investigation opens enough eyes among athletes (and especially among kids) so that we can, in this instance, return to a simpler time in the best of all sports. In that regard, the San Francisco Chronicle is doing the Lord's work by disclosing the "confidential" grand jury testimony. That Bonds, Giambi and others could be so stupid -- in both what they admit and what they deny -- is absolutely mind-blogging, er, mind-boggling.

OK, folks, enough of this depressing crap. I just spent my lunch hour over at MLB.COM stuffing the ballot box for all the Twins nominees for the This Year in Baseball awards. I paused for a moment to watch the video of Supernatural's 14 strikeouts against Baltimore (a game I was lucky enough to have seen in the flesh). (Make that "gooseflesh.") Try it. You'll feel much better.

Smitty

Smitty,

That's a good idea. I had resorted to checking up on women's college basketball to cheer myself up(I had to abandon men's after I discovered three players on my alma mater are about to be suspended). But I realize that doesn't work for everyone.

Redbird

Hey Bat-Girl and fellow Batlings!

Please allow me to share some positive baseball notes that brings back the love of the game and its' history.

One of my financial planning clients made his own Christmas Card to send to me. He knows my love of baseball and the Twins, so his card was decorated with cut-out photographs of baseballs autographed by the likes of Mickey Mantle, Reggie Jackson, Duke Snider, Stan Musial, etc,.... It's a very endearing card.

This is why baseball is different from the other pro sports. I have a hard time imagining someone would take the time to do that with footballs or hockey pucks ( or finding those types of photos easily on the web or in magazines ). This is why America loves Baseball.

Just wanted to pass along and brighten someone's day and not let all the steroid controversy stuff be too depressing.

( Oh, and JustBeth - My CI is also 4 - but workin' on it )

The Torii Hunter video amuses me a bit. I think most of us would wonder why single that one out, but I guess in New York they think that's a pretty fancy catch.

Donnalove watches college hockey to feel better about missing baseball, and all the bad things baseball players are doing.

Er, I listen to college hockey over the internet. Although tomorrow night I'll be seeing it live in Wisconsin! WHEEEEEEEEEE!

Jeez, call me a contrarian but all this moralizing is making me quesy. Memo to evryone - steroids didn't fall out the freakin' sky in 2001. There is a HUGE liklihood that steroid use has been rampant in MLB (and other pro sports) for many, many years (generations?). I keep wondering what all the barry haters out there (which is all there sseem to be these days) make of this past season? Everyone seemed to be a-twitter at spring training as they assumed that the BALCO bust would mean we would see a skinny, struggling Bonds. What happened? Oh, only quite possibly the greatest season by a player in MLB history? What accounts for this? Residual cream? Maybe it's aliens. Steroids can confer a modest benefit to performance but they can't make Clark Kent Superman. If Barry became the player he is because of steroids you'd be seeing alot more guys like him. And the fact of the matter is that you don't. You mostly get big guys who hit lots of dingers for a couple of years and then fade badly into the sunset. And let's not even get into McGwire. You're really going to tell me that guy wasn't juiced? Puh-leeze. But even if he was, what did it get him? One great season. What Barry has done over the last 5+ seasons is completly without precedent in baseball history. In all categories - not just home runs. So before you begin calling for lifetime bans, et al I think you need to check yourself, before you wreck yourself.

If MLB doesn't discredit Bonds records, they will have as much credibility as pro wrestling.The MVP awards, the homerun records, the walk records all most be discredited.

Bonds was a terrific player before the drugs, and well on his way to the hall fame, and to being one of the best players of his era. A top 20 all time. His cheating to inflate his stats to increase his place in history should disqualify him from all baseball records.

Bud Selig needs to make a stand and save baseball

Redbird wrote: 2) If Bonds was taking steroids and then stopped, how come he doesn't look any physically different?

Umm. Take a look at ANY picture of Bonds in a Pirates uni. ANY of them. Just a cursory glance. No need to pore over them laboriously.

Peep a pic of Big Mac these days as well. I think he shed about, oh, 70 lbs.

double-a,

Actually I meant, if he had stopped taking the stuff "he didn't know" was steroids before last season, why hasn't he lost some of that muscle mass. He looks about the same as he did a few seasons ago.

Or perhaps he's found some other "flaxseed oil" type substance to keep that from happening.

I don't dispute there's a difference from the Pirates days, although at least some of that has got to be just getting older and going to a more rigorous training schedule.

Redbird,

I have yet to find a rigorous training schedule that causes my cranium to triple in size.

Best regards,
YankeeFan

Ugh - this is really amusing, the whole Sterry thing. How can you NOT know you're taking steriods... and when you, um, start to "enlarge", you continue to take it? Right... Roids are not cool, kids.

YankeeFan, I know you are referring to the oft-reported side effect of HGH overuse known as acromegaly. While one symptom of acromegaly is indeed an increase in hat size, other symptoms may include arthritis, fatigue, loss of vision and headaches. Could someone really perform as well as Bonds while suffering from all that?

tribescribe:

First, I was only referring to the fact that, objectively speaking and without jumping to any conclusion, one fact about Barry Bonds is clear:

His head has grown considerably. Take a look.

Nevertheless, a few responses to your post come to mind -- pick one:

A) "oh, you're right - I guess he's not on steroids...never mind."

B) "Obviously, yes."

C) "Well, there might be one guy out of all that are taking steroids that is lucky enough not to exhibit those side effects."

D) "Let's do mandatory drug testing and ban everyone from baseball who dooes steroids, and we'll see who's left, and let's see how they perform."

YankeeFan

Tribescribe asks whether someone could really perform at Bonds-like levels if he was suffering from side effects like headaches, fatigue, and arthritis. In fact Bonds says he started taking that Really Expensive Flaxseed Oil precisely because he suffers from headaches, fatigue, and arthritis.

On a contrary note, my own hat size increased significantly a couple years back, shortly before I turned 30. And I've never used either the clear or the cream. Sometimes a person's head just gets bigger, whether you're talking metaphorically or physically.

Has anyone else noticed how similar is the evidence between Pete Rose's betting-on-baseball scandal and Bonds' doping charges? In both cases it's dated papers with cryptic notes and dollar amounts. They banned Shoeless Joe with less evidence.

Song by Dan Bern... I tend to agree.

If Barry Bonds is really taking something
To hit make him hit more homers than before
They gotta throw him out of the game, sir
They gotta throw him out the door

Then burn the porn films with all the girls with implants
Burn the poetry by men who took lithium as boys
Your erection compliments of Levitra
Is hereby rendered null and soft and void

Then rip the contact lenses from your eyes, sir
You’re not really supposed to see naturally that well
No more flu shots or antibiotics
You’re supposed to still be sick my friend

In the future they say we’re gonna live
180 years, or 200
And you know they’ll be some jerk going around pointing
Saying you’re supposed to be dead, supposed to be dead

Disgrace by hint and suspicion
It’s point and cast a cloud of instant shame
And the president stamps the witch hunt with approval
And McCarthy gets sent back into the game

I’d like to now make a statement
I’d like to make a statement now
For a three-year period I was taking steroids
And my songs for that time are now in doubt

I apologize to my family
I apologize to you, the fans
I apologize to the very craft of songwriting
I’ll take my punishment with all the grace I can

"God Said No" and "Black Tornado," throw ‘em out
I wrote them while the juice was in my veins
Everything I’ve sung since "Fuck the Monkey"
Go ahead and throw it down the drain

Imagine a world where everyone’s taking something
Imagine such a world then just for fun
Imagine the president’s taking smart pills
That’d be even better than 73 home runs

Disgrace by hint and suspicion
It’s point and cast a cloud of instant shame
And the president stamps the witch hunt with approval
And McCarthy gets sent back into the game

73
73
73 home runs

73
73
73 home runs

Redbird...

My mistake. I mis-read your comment. And I agree that *if* Bonds actually did stop with the human chemistry experiment a year ago, we likely would have seen some change in phyical stature. Unless he merely changed from one set of chemicals to another.

...and chose his words with Clinton-esque precision.

Oh, and the head continues to grow throughout life. As do the nose and ears.

It is pretty sad to read many of the reactions to the steriod issue. A few observations:
1) Why is grand jury testimony being leaked to the media?
2) Have people thoroughly considered the impact of steriod use? It does not improve hand-eye coordination. If Bonds benefitted it was because it increased strength to allow him to play more games. It would be interesting to see documentation on how much farther balls travel due to steroid use.
3) Shame on MLB for not having a steroid policy. Since they didn't, did anyone break any rules? As fans, don't we want our players to better themselves in ways within the constraints of the rules? And where do we draw the line? Prior to the 70's it was almost unheard of for baseball players to lift weights. Should there be a ban on weight-lifting because it increases strength allowing hitters to hit farther and pitchers to throw harder? That sounds like performance enhancement to me.
4) Anyone who has been deposed in a court of law knows you don't answer a question under oath unless you absolutely know the answer. Sure Bonds could probably guess what the notations in Anderson's calendar meant ... but only Anderson really knows for sure. If you start guessing while being questioned by an attorney, they will have you tied up in a corner before you can bat an eye.

Yeah, let's just excuse Bonds and the other cheaters/drug users.

If Bonds used steroids, it wasn't the fault of the media leaks, the grand jury, MLB rules and policy or any of that.

Personal responsibility is becoming a foreign term, but there are some fans who still believe in it.

A few posters have said Bonds is great because of his vision and bat-speed, not steroid-induced strength. Those drugs help vision and bad speed too, especially HGH (Human growth hormone). They work. He cheated.

HGH causes your head to grow too. His hat size grew a full inch. I wonder, do you shrink back down after you stop taking HGH like you do when you quit steroids? I don't know. But I don't think so. Some of muscle will go when he gets off the juice, but his head and hands may stay big. That would look weird!

As for his defense that he didn't know what Anderson was giving him, that's ridiculous. Anderson would tell it all to Giambi, but not a notorious control freak like Bonds? Check out this article:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/magazine/10/04/sheffield_bonds1011/

excerpt: "The only thing Greg Anderson does is what Barry tells him to do," Sheffield says. "Barry ran everything. If I'm training and if he sees Greg making me do one curl too many, it's an argument: 'I told you, don't have him do no more than he needs!' So I knew Greg was a puppet. All these guys around [Bonds] were puppets. They used to confide in me about how they hated it."

This is great too, about his control-freakiness:

To thank Bonds for inviting him into his home, Sheffield arranged for the two of them to see a boxing match in Miami on Feb. 2, 2002. "I was going to pay for the plane, the flight, pay for the limo service, the hotel," Sheffield says. "He gets my mail. He looks in my mail and sees he can get better seats, so he gets better seats. He can get a better flight, so he gets a better flight. He can get a better limo service. And he can get a better hotel...

They'll never sort out the proven guilty from the guilty but too slick. Are we better off with an asterisk after Bonds but not McGwire? He was juiced too. But suppose you remove him too--What about Sosa? Was he really clean? (personally I'd be amazed, but where's the proof?

Punishing some is better than punishing none, but it's no solution. The real focus should be on the future. Clean it up once and for all--if not for the sake of the players, for the millions of kids who emulate them.

p.s. the biggest hypocrite is Bud Selig, who when Canseco admitted he used steroids and said half the league was on them called a press conference to denounce Canseco as a liar.

I doubt half the league is using them.

I think it's a relatively small group. But they would like you to think it's half the league, because "everybody's doing it" makes those who are come off like they are just doing what they have to do to compete.

Part of the clean-up has to include punishing those who did it in the past. Their stats are forever tainted and it's noone's fault but their own. If some cheaters get away that is regrettable, but that shouldn't prevent the proven guilty from facing consequences.

The old adage in baseball . . . "if you ain't cheatin' you ain't tryin'" . . . is really being tested this week.

Everybody is outraged, but what about the honor roll of heroes of the 1990s.

Jose Canseco

Ken Caminiti

Brady Anderson
the miracle 50 HR year -- check out this photo: www.insidejoke.tv/images/200108/bradyanderson.jpg

And of course everyone's favorites from 1998
Mark McGwire and Sammy Sosa.

So we are all shocked to find out . . . through leaked court-sealed documents . . . that Bonds, Giambi, et al, were in on it too.

The players union and the owners knew what was going on and let it continue. The players were just taking the time-honored tradition of spit-balls, stealing signs, corked bats, sharpened spikes, scuffed balls, etc., to a different level.

"If you ain't cheatin', you ain't trying." It's not so funny now.

I agree with both your points Franorama. Everybody'd doing it is a lame excuse. But we know it's at least 5%, and that's just the people who, after being given a free pass to dope all off-season to their heart's content, didn't even bother to get clean for their scheduled and announced drug tests in spring training.

But there really should be some way to expunge tainted stats. Players should have to provide a permanent, archived sample that can be tested years later when testers catch up to previous cheating methods.

We hear on ESPN and FOX news and all the rest about Bonds 24/7 during the baseball season (at the expense of most of our personal favorite players/teams accomplishments)...And every sports writer was definitely aware of the BALCO

Yet they ignored it and voted AGAIN for Bonds for MVP.

I feel frustration towards national sports writers who ignored this information...I think they should take an active lead in what happens next since they awarded him so many MVP's...

I think it would be great if somehow, they unanimously asked to re-vote this year...

And--Why was this info leaked?

Who stands to gain anything? Does anyone?

Somoene mentioned these leaks coinciding with the Victor Conte 20/20 interview Friday...